From the U.S. Government Accountability Office, www.gao.gov Transcript for: Post-9/11 GI Bill Overpayments Description: Audio Interview by GAO staff with Melissa Emrey-Arras, Director, Education, Workforce, and Income Security Related GAO Work: GAO-16-42: Post-9/11 GI Bill: Additional Actions Needed to Help Reduce Overpayments and Increase Collections. Released: October 2015 [ Narrator: ] Welcome to GAO's Watchdog Report, your source for news and information from the U.S. Government Accountability Office. It's October 2015. Of the 10.8 billion dollars in Post-9/11 GI Bill benefits the Department of Veterans Affairs paid out in fiscal year 2014, VA identified 416 million dollars in overpayments. A team led by Melissa Emrey-Arras, a director in GAO's Education, Workforce, and Income Security team, recently reviewed these overpayments, which can create financial hardships for veterans who are generally required to pay them back. GAO's Jacques Arsenault sat down with Melissa to talk about what they found. [ Jacques Arsenault: ] Can you give me a sense of the size and scope of the Post-9/11 GI Bill and how it serves our veterans? [ Melissa Emrey-Arras: ] The Post-9/11 GI Bill program is VA's largest education benefit program, and it covers tuition, housing, books, and can be used at a wide range of schools, including public schools, non-profits, and for-profits. [ Jacques Arsenault: ] Now, on the subject of overpayments, it's easy to understand how VA overpaying on benefits could be a waste of taxpayer dollars, but your report says that it's also creating hardships for vets. Can you tell me a little more about how that works? [ Melissa Emrey-Arras: ] So, overpayments most often happen when VA pays for a student's expenses at the very beginning of the school term. And then what happens is a student later decides to drop a class or withdraw completely from school. And this creates a debt, then, that the veteran needs to repay to VA. And we found that those debts average $570 per person, and some went as high as over $20,000, which can be very difficult for folks to repay, especially if they're on limited incomes, as many veterans are. And if they don't repay those debts, VA will eventually withhold their tax refunds or report them to credit agencies, which can affect their credit score. So it's something that definitely does affect veterans. [ Jacques Arsenault: ] And is this something that the veterans know about in advance, or are they being surprised? [ Melissa Emrey-Arras: ] That's a good question. We found that veterans can often be surprised by this. One of the reasons is that there's very limited guidance from VA on this whole process. So we found out that some people don't even know that there's an overpayment process until they've incurred a debt. So imagine finding out that way you've got this debt and then you find out there's this issue. Another factor is that VA notifies people by hard copy letters in regular mail, and does not use email to connect with veterans about these debts, which can be a real challenge given that VA often sends these to the address that the veteran used when they initially applied for benefits, and veterans may move to attend school. And so the vetereans may never get the letter that was intended to tell them about the debt. [ Jacques Arsenault: ] So what does the overpayment situation look like right now? [ Melissa Emrey-Arras: ] We found that, in 2014, VA identified 416 million in overpayments. This affected about 1 in every 4 veterans participating in the program, which came to about 225,000 veterans. [ Jacques Arsenault: ] And how can VA be doing a better job of addressing these issues that you mentioned? [ Melissa Emrey-Arras: ] We make multiple recommendations in this report. Some of the key ones that I'd like to highlight are, one, VA needs to provide guidance to veterans so they are aware of this overpayment process, so it's not a surprise to them, so that they don't learn about it after they've incurred a debt. Another recommendation is that they find additional ways to let veterans know about these debts, for example, by using email, so that we can make sure that veterans who do have debts find out about them as soon as possible. And we're also recommending that VA require veterans to tell the schools and tell VA as soon as they drop out of school. So, right now, there's no requirement for monthly verification, unlike with a lot of other VA educational programs, and we're recommending that VA say, on a monthly basis, veterans should affirm that they're still going to class. [ Jacques Arsenault: ] And that would help address some of these issues before they go further down the road. [ Melissa Emrey-Arras: ] Definitely, because the longer somebody waits to tell VA, the benefits are still going to them. And at that point, just the overpayments are increasing with time and to really stop that from happening, it's best to let VA know as soon as possible, and then that overpayment can be avoided, or at least lessened. [ Jacques Arsenault: ] And finally, for our veterans, what would you say is the bottom line of this report? [ Melissa Emrey-Arras: ] I think the bottom line is that, as soon as you decide to drop a class or withdraw from school, it's important that you let VA know, that you let the school know, so that the overpayment does not continue. Also, it's important that you contact VA's educational call center to let them know what your current address is. This is particularly important if you have moved since you originally applied for benefits. This will help make sure that you find out if you do, in fact, have an overpayment and there aren't any surprises for you down the road. And in terms of VA, our thought is that we really want VA to pay attention to this report, to implement these recommendations, to make the process smoother for veterans, and also collect money that the government is owed, because taxpayers are also on the hook here. [ Background Music ] [ Narrator: ] To learn more, visit GAO.gov and be sure to tune in to the next episode of GAO's Watchdog Report for more from the congressional watchdog, the U.S. Government Accountability Office.